Separation Progress
Posted at 10:19 am February 16, 2009 by Ellie RosenbaumThe amount of time that Bai Yun and Zhen Zhen are physically being separated is slowly increasing, with predictable results. As we’ve seen during past weanings, the behavior of even the most independent cubs can suddenly shift to being more mother-centered, seeking the comfort of nursing more often (although the amount of actual milk may not be that great, and cubs continue to eat their copious amounts of bamboo), and soliciting more interaction with Mom. It’s as if the cubs (Zhen Zhen included) have received the letter but don’t necessarily like the message it contains.
ZZ has spent more time trying to nurse and more time sleeping next to Bai Yun than I’ve seen in a very long time. Bai, conversely, is trying to escape the presence of the determined little cub by moving from side to side within the two exhibits, with ZZ hot on her heels. (ZZ actually tried to dive from one side of the pool to ambush her mother on the other side, falling into the pool as a result. She missed, but undaunted, she continued to pursue Bai back into the other exhibit. The girl’s got spunk!) This persistance and sudden re-interest in Mom is typical: it’s been observed with ZZ’s elder siblings, Hua Mei, Mei Sheng, and Su Lin. The level of interaction is becoming much firmer on Mom’s part, although not yet aggressive, but it appears from her behavior that Bai Yun is ready for ZZ to move on, also pretty typical at this stage of weaning The research and keeper staff are watching carefully. As always, it is the behavior of the bears that will determine the actual timetable for separation.
While there is a tentative schedule, it becomes more flexible with each passing day, so don’t be surprised at who you see where as you log onto Pandacam to follow the happenings here. Remember that this is a necessary step in the development of young pandas.
Ellie Rosenbaum is a panda narrator at the San Diego Zoo.
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February 16th, 2009 at 1:26 pm
I’m gonna cry…in human terms atleast we get to see our mother , hug her whatever..sigh
February 16th, 2009 at 2:12 pm
Hi Debbie, Yes, of late, I have noticed Zhen pursuing Bai and vice versa. This morning at 10:22, I enjoyed watching Zhen Zhen and Bai Yun having a nursing session in the hollowed out tree. It was so sweet to watch them snuggled in the tight space together. They were obviously trying to get out of the steady rain that we are having in San Diego.
After nursing, Zhen Zhen walked toward the viewing window and climbed up a tall spindly tree. In spite of the rain, Zhen settled in for a nice long nap.
February 16th, 2009 at 2:19 pm
It’s so sad. Yesterday ZZ followed her mama everywhere as if she was afraid she’d vanish. On Saturday Bai and ZZ did alot of play fighting and I noticed that Bai initiated most of it. I do understand they have to be separated before Bai gets aggressive with ZZ but it doesn’t make it any easier. Watching the two of them now eating boo together is so bitter sweet.
February 17th, 2009 at 1:33 am
I’m feeling sad as well. Before I started watching the lead-up to the separation I wondered what all the fuss was about but I soon found out. At first it was amusing but the more I watched the more I realised that ‘things are happening’. Zhen Zhen is Bai’s shadow and it’s quite obvious that Bai is becoming irritated by this and turns on ZZ – luckily, as Kathy #3 says, not aggressively at the moment. But I can see it might turn a little nasty at some point. I know it’s part of the weaning process, but boy, it hurts us poor humans doesn’t it?! For the time being at least, I’m sending loads of postcards and enjoying the last days/weeks of the ‘Intrepid Duo’.
Nice to see Gao Gao yesterday, plodding through his bamboo with his usual obvious enjoyment.
February 17th, 2009 at 11:36 am
Like the others, who have left comments, I have been watching the interaction between Mom and Cub, I guess it won’t be long now will it? I remember Su Lin was not happy when the gate was finally closed, but, boy, what a beautiful and settled girl she has become. I hope the same will happen to little ZZ.
Thanks for keeping us informed, and especially for Panda Cam. I wish I could visit more often, but, I live out in South Carolina, and can only visit when I come and see my daughter and her family in San Diego. By then we may have another little cub?
February 17th, 2009 at 11:37 am
If you are crying or about to cry about weaning process, go to YouTube and watch “Cute Panda in San Diego Zoo”, besides making you smile or laugh, you will understand why Bai Yun is looking forward to some peace and quite… I love the music as well.
February 17th, 2009 at 11:48 am
It seems to me that the separation process should be like pulling off a Band-Aid, rip it off once and be done with it, a little at a time prolongs the pain. Wouldn’t it be easier, once the first overnight separation occurs, to shut the door for good then? Not prolong the pain, as it were?
February 17th, 2009 at 12:12 pm
Looks like ZZ is trying to nurse right now in that little hut thingee. LOL! Love you ZZ……xoxo
February 17th, 2009 at 12:21 pm
So cute. At last I’ve caught Bai and ZZ in the tree stump. Bless them both.
February 17th, 2009 at 12:42 pm
*sniff* ZZ is sleeping with her head on mama’s neck and her paw around her head after nursing. I watched ZZ pacing and trying to climb the doors before they were reunited…this is going to be a 2 box kleenex week..I just know it!
February 17th, 2009 at 12:44 pm
Thanks for the update, Ellie. It’s sad for us humans; so foreign to our maternal instincts. HOWEVER, it’s time; both ZZ and Bai have bigger things to do in the future! But really cute seeing them both together in the hollowed out tree……..ZZ is sleeping with her head across Bai’s neck. Tugs at my heart!
February 17th, 2009 at 12:55 pm
The weaning process appear to be so cruel. A child gets from a lot of love from mom to none. Poor baby ZZ!
February 17th, 2009 at 12:56 pm
I have been watching the whole morning and afternoon so far, I was so touched and sad as well. Hope everything is good for both of them…….
February 17th, 2009 at 1:16 pm
Oh…I wasn’t going to read these blogs until they were separated!!! I just can’t “bear” to read the part that mom gets aggressive and rejects her and with this new info today…It feels like it’s coming….Sad isn’t the word…now that I’ve upset myself because I just had to know…I will return to my work and bury myself…hang in there zz….you will soon forget and plan your new life….Auntie Tami loves you so muches…XXXOOOOXOXOXOOO
February 17th, 2009 at 1:19 pm
I don’t know who takes this weaning process worse, ZZ or us. Everytime I read or watch the camera the tears start. I try to convince myself that better times are ahead by thinking of what’s to come this year in the way of new babies, but it’s still hard.
February 17th, 2009 at 1:47 pm
Oh my goodness – the photo of Bai and Zhen lying nose-to-nose peering out from the hollowed-out tree this morning at 10:46 AM PT is absolutely the most adorable picture. The weaning process is so sad and painful for the pandas and all panda lovers. Lately, I have noticed that Bai seems to be enjoying Zhen’s company more and more.
Recently, I read an article about Fu Long, the 18-month-old panda in Vienna. Supposedly, they don’t have any specific plans or timetables to separate their cub from its mother. They are going to allow nature to take its course when the mother reaches estrus. I thought that in order for a nursing female panda to reach estrus she had to be separated from her cub. Is their plan possible?
February 17th, 2009 at 2:36 pm
Rose, #16, thanks for the information about Zoo Vienna’s plans to let Fu Long stay with his mother. It seems it would be possible; she could keep him from nursing and in doing so she would go into estrus. Of course they would have to separate them (temporarily) in order for her to be with the male to mate (assuming they are planning on natural mating again).
It would be interesting to see how long she tolerates the cub being with her, should she become pregnant. This might make for a very interesting study.
February 17th, 2009 at 9:36 pm
Barbara in Midwest #17 – Thanks for your interesting reply. I understand what you’re saying, however, in a closed environment how can the mother prevent the cub from nursing? The mother would have to spend most of her time trying to avoid her very persistent cub. In all probability, the cub would win out.
If the mother does go into estrus, they would have to separate her from the cub anyway. So it seems there is no gain in following this plan. It will be interesting to see if the Vienna Zoo is successful in keeping their pandas together. In doing this comparison, I’ve come to understand that the weaning process at the San Diego Zoo is a better choice.
Barbara, your statement, “This might make for a very interesting study” is so true.
February 19th, 2009 at 12:01 am
Poor Zhennie! Getting the “pink slip”, or rather just the slip, from her mommy Bai has got to be hard. I’ve been thinking about her a lot lately as the weaning is progressing. I hope she can be consoled when Su Lin gets to go back on exhibit beside her. Please make opportunities for them to meet at the “howdy gate” and in the trees to see and “talk” to each other like it was when Mei Sheng was here. When weaning is complete will you let Su Lin be on exhibit with her? Not together, but next door?