Change is Good
Posted at 12:38 pm September 19, 2007 by Suzanne HallFall is coming, and change is in the air at the San Diego Zoo’s Giant Panda Research Station. Last week the weather changed again, and we have had delightfully cool mornings followed by moderate daytime temperatures for several days. The new bus route past the panda facility has proved to be pretty uneventful for the bears (see blog, A New Day in Panda Canyon), as after a few days out Mei Sheng and Su Lin don’t even blink when the buses pass by. Mei Sheng is being prepped for his departure to China, scheduled to occur sometime next month. But the biggest changes are visible right there on the Panda Cam.
Our not-so-giant panda is growing by leaps and bounds! I watched her closely on Sunday and Monday night (my data collection nights until late next month) and was amazed. She is so big now that it is hard for Bai Yun to lie down and hold the baby up off the ground. Invariably, when she is picked up, parts of her slop over momma’s paws and flop onto the ground. Only when sitting in an upright posture can Bai Yun seem to contain the cub on her body!
The cub is also very content. Bai Yun was out of the den on Monday night for nearly an hour and 30 minutes, eating and resting, and the cub was quietly resting during her absence. Some of you have asked if the quietness might reflect some sort of developmental delay. I am not a vet, but in my opinion this is just a personality trait with our youngster. I also observed her during a nursing bout on Sunday in which she seemed insistent on nursing on the upper right of Bai Yun’s four nipples while Bai Yun kept nosing the cub over to the upper left. I am not sure why Bai Yun was doing this (perhaps that side was more engorged? Or less tender?), but the cub wasn’t having any of it. She squawked repeatedly each time momma tried to decide for her where she should nurse. She furiously head-bobbed her way back to the preferred nipple in a determined fashion each time momma released her grip. Ultimately, Bai Yun gave up, and the cub finally satisfied her belly in a manner that suited her. This cub makes plenty of noise and shows lots of spunk when the chips are down. Behaviorally, she seems right on track to me. I guess I would describe her as a slow-burner: a cub who is mellow most of the time but willing to fire up for the right reasons.
Bai Yun has taken the cub out of the den at least once but only for a very brief time. Our rotund little girl has rolled her way out of the den more than once as well, with Bai Yun always retrieving her and returning her to the sanctity of the den. But though the cub can, with some effort, roll over now, it will be some time before she leaves the den under her own power. For comparison, Su Lin didn’t do this until sometime in December 2005. I think it’s fair to say, though, that Su Lin could have left the den earlier (she was physically capable of it) but she chose to remain sequestered. We’ll see if our current little bear grows up with a similar affinity for the quiet of the space in which she was born.
Speaking of change, as I write this I find myself correcting my lingo repeatedly. I have to keep reminding myself to replace “it” with words like “she” and “her.” See, even I am having trouble keeping up with the rapid pace of change around here!
Suzanne Hall is a senior research technician with the San Diego Zoo’s Giant Panda Unit of Applied Animal Ecology.
Listen to a new iZoofari Chat with panda keeper Kathy Hawk, posted September 21.
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September 19th, 2007 at 1:11 pm
Thank you Suzanne for another very informative posting about our favorite little panda baby girl.
I noticed that Bai Yun had been very absent from her den today, as almost everytime I went to check on Cubbette, she was all alone. I was wondering if that was normal until you made this post, and I am now reassured that everything is perfectly all right.
I was remembering that back when Su Lin was born, you had posted a comparative chart between Hua Mei, Mei Sheng and her noting how many vocalizations the cub made in what stage of the cub’s life. I think it could be interesting to see this chart updated with data from the new baby bear.
I wonder what lies in store for the future, I can’t wait to see the newest addition to the SDZ panda family grow!!!
I’ll keep watching, so all of you at SDZ, keep up the good work!
Clara
September 19th, 2007 at 1:21 pm
Thanks for the updates Suzanne. It’s amazing to watch yet another panda baby grow and develop.
One thing I was wondering about this week is how solitary pandas would be in the wild if there were more of them. From reading comments and watching panda cams it seems that pandas are interested in each other. From the howdy gate in SD to the pandas in other USA zoos being kept together as well as the ones in Vienna being kept together and with a cub in there too. I even had the chance this week to observe the National Zoo Pandas where the two adults were togther and Tai Shan was at a howdy gate taking to them.
Has research been done on this?
Talking of the National Zoo pandas if they are on camera alone how do people know which one they are looking at? I have a lot of trouble with this and guess most of the time.
September 19th, 2007 at 1:47 pm
Suzanne, Thank you for the update-I can picture what you explain. This is very useful since the Panda Cam is still so very dark only rarely can we see the outline of the precious little cub. I can hardly wait for the repairs as I already miss both Mom and Cub. Blessings to all! Claudia
September 19th, 2007 at 1:48 pm
Thanks for the update Suzanne! I keep checking Panda Cam and the time lapse video to see if the cub is outside the den. I have seen her very close to the edge several times, but not caught her outside yet. Since it has been verifyed that she has been, I will have to find a slow Internet connection so I can replay the videos more slowly.
Any videos of Mei Sheng and Su Lin available yet? Are they still interacting at Howdy Gate, or have they given that up since they have been switched?
Cubby is practicing her push ups in the air a lot lately. She will gain strength in her legs soon enough to start supported her round little belly and bottom end. She will be mobile the rest of her life, so it is great she is mellow and enjoying her sleep and peace now.
September 19th, 2007 at 1:54 pm
Thanks for the update — it’s all such interesting information! I have seen our little one squacking when she’s on her back and can’t roll over (and Bai Lin is gone), so I know she can be lively.
September 19th, 2007 at 3:32 pm
Clara #1,
I will be happy to post a graphic representation of our data just as soon as we catch up on our data entry! We have been busy, busy busy!
Celf #2,
Pandas are thought to be solitary due to their dependence on bamboo as a food source. Traveling in a social group means bears would be sitting together and eating a patch of bamboo together. This means the patch would be depleted sooner and bears would have to spend more time searching for food. By remaining solitary a panda does not have to share his/her immediate food resources with competitors. Adult pandas in captivity have the luxury of extra time on their hands because they don’t subsist exclusively on bamboo, which takes 14 hours or more per day to acquire in the wild. They can afford to be more social if they wish because they do not face competition for food. This is not to say all pandas would be social under the right conditions: neither Shi Shi nor Bai Yun ever showed an interest in spending time with other adult bears outside the breeding season.
Margaret #4,
Mei Sheng and Su Lin do still get howdy gate access a few mornings per week. How much time they spend together seems to wax and wane.
September 19th, 2007 at 5:53 pm
Thank you Suzanne. Change is indeed good and if I were a betting person I’d bet that our little or not so little girl is going to come out of that den when she is able to walk and not look back. She hasn’t seemed shy at all but she still can’t see can she? See how determined she is now and she is technically blind. Imagine what she is going to think when those eyes open up.
I think you are right about her quietness when momma is out. This is part of her temperment and perhaps a sign that she feels more secure now. Bai Yun has done everything she could in this short time and look what we have. A very large baby panda, a very determined one and seemingly happy (when she gets her own way). She might change once she comes out and sees the people but I think she’ll adjust quicker than most.
The fact that Bai Yun is comfortable leaving her alone so long says much about the security she feels within the Zoo and with the staff.
September 19th, 2007 at 6:07 pm
Wow looks like the little one IS growing fast. It was some time tho’ if I remember correctly, before Bai carried Su Lin out of the den with her, yes? Seems that this little one is not only growing faster, but seems mom is kinda speeding up the process a bit as well. Or shall we say showing her the ropes earlier.
September 19th, 2007 at 6:47 pm
Suzanne – thanks for another informative update on our cubbette. Seems like she can be vocal when needed, otherwise she just takes life as it comes – why fuss when she has such a wonderful mother. Will be wating for her next exam to see if her eyes are open yet & how much she weighs.
September 19th, 2007 at 8:01 pm
note to #3. Claudia …I too could not see until my husband showed me a feature of our monitor. At the bottom beneath the screen is a button with the title ” ultrabrite mode” . This will brighten 3 times and 5 times. I always use this when looking at the panda screens. I also enlarge the picture from 100% to 200% and that makes it easier to see too. Hope this helps you.
September 19th, 2007 at 8:11 pm
Thanks for the update, I am happy to hear about how grown up our little starlet is. I really like the story of how she was determined to have her choice of location for nursing. She knows what she wants and even at almost 7 weeks old, knows how to get it… Why did we ever doubt she was a girl?!!
I just started reading the book about ” the original Su Lin” and the panda cub’s visit to the US. How interesting that it changed so many of the ways American Zoos operated: Focusing on wildlife conservation and enrichment for the captive animals. I am glad that the Western world was able to find the giant pandas so we can enjoy them. And I am glad that we live in an age when the animals are valued and kept in humane conditions with their best interest at heart. Thank you for being part of that and for going further to do the research that helps the wild pandas.
I am glad that Su Lin and Mei Sheng are OK with the bus noises. I do hope that the bus operators can keep control of the riders, especially in the later hours. I know that is a problem with the Skyfari during the summer extended hours. I saw first hand several times how much it stressed the pandas out to have unfamiliar loud noises. I hope they can remain stress-free during the new bus route times.
Thanks for another great update on all things SDZ panda.
It seems to me that Bright Star should be ready soon for her close-up, in the lights.
Love, Joy
September 19th, 2007 at 8:42 pm
# 2 celfyddydau – Regarding Mei Xiang & Tian at the NZ – you’re right it’s to tell the pandas apart but from what I can tell It’s usually Tian that instigates the session & Mei will play until she’s had enough, then she gives him a good swat & he runs off.
September 19th, 2007 at 8:47 pm
Hi, Suzanne! Thanks for the new update! I was hoping that you would get one out ASAP, and you did just that! Very good info! Got on the cam and saw baby girl all by herself earlier today and just a few minutes ago with her mom. From what you wrote, it sounds like this little cub has a mind of her own already! She tries very hard to get her way especially when it comes to getting her milk! Now I’m wondering how she’s going to act once she gets those little peepers opened up (which I’m still waiting on news about!) and gets all 4 legs and feet moving! She’s getting her way now, so I’m thinking that she’s gonna be the type of panda ” kid” that will want to get her way when she gets older! Watch out, Bai! You will have a paw full of daughter very soon!! This little girl is starting to show her assertiveness already! More fun to come on the pandacam!!
Gonna go and watch the pandas! Again, let us know about her eyes opening up as soon as you find that out, and when all of us panda lovers will be able to vote for a name for this cub’s 100th day birthday. I’m sure that you have a whole lot of suggestions from me and everybody else by now and the list is pretty long!
Luv yas to Bai and baby girl,
Chari Mercier
St. Pete, FL
September 20th, 2007 at 3:45 am
#2 celfyddydau – I can always tell the adult pandas in NZ apart by their eyes…they have very different shaped eyes. Mei’s are very round and Tian’s are a bit longer and narrower. I think Tai has a combination of both their eye shape. Pam in Rhode Island.
September 20th, 2007 at 7:49 am
Since the cubs eyes don’t seem to be open yet, it makes sense that Bai Yun and the cub feel more comfortable with the cub in the nice warm, dry, safe den. She would be unable to defend herself in the wild since she can’t see or move. There is no point in Bai Yun moving her out until she is fully developed and able to move. As I recall, cubs have been placed on bedding outside the den after their check-ups (e.g. Mei Lan) in an attempt to see if the dam would let them be outside the den, only to have mom immediately move them back into the den. When Bai is ready she will move the cub when and where she wants her to be. Bai knows best, and her instincts are ruling her actions, not human motivations or inclinations. We want to see cubby so badly that we are trying to ” rush” the process, but we have to remember that panda cubs develop physiologically greater outside the womb than other animals that have a longer gestation period. We must be patient and let nature run its course.
September 20th, 2007 at 10:30 am
Here in Michigan it’s 10:27am SD time and the panda-cam is providing what I’d call an extreme close-up of the cutest little panda buns I’ve seen since Mei Lan was that age. I don’t remember reading that Panda Cam is fixed yet, so this is a real treat! Can’t wait for the next exam to find out how our little cubbie is doing. Thanks to Suzanne and the rest of the SDZ crew for everything. We love you folks as much as we do the pandas!
September 20th, 2007 at 12:18 pm
Speaking of cute pandas… I ran across a hysterically funny video of Mei Lan on her 1st birthday on 6 September. The video has been sped up a bit and it’s done to The Beatles ” Birthday” song.. give it a look. Bright Star Cubette grows more adorable daily!
September 20th, 2007 at 12:29 pm
What a wonderful site and an awesome find in the blogs! Only in the last few months have I visited the Panda blogs here, but I visit the NZ every few months and have watched the cams daily since Tai’s birth, and then Mei Lan’s birth. I found the blogs quite by accident, but have been an avid reader ever since. I’ve loved all the information to be found here!! Now all 4 US zoo cams are in my favorites.
celfyddydau #2. To tell the difference in the NZ Pandas. Tian Tian has kidney shaped eye patches and his back band narrows quite a lot and almost like a ” bra” ..in a way much like Mei Shengs. Mei Xiongs eye patches are rounder and her band is quite wide. Tai Shan is a combination of the two. His eye patches are round like Mei’s, and his band is wider than Tian’s but not as wide as Mei’s. Probably the easiest way to tell on Panda Cam is Tai Shan is almost always on PandaCam2, where as his parents are on PandaCam1..which by the way doesn’ t have the ” 1″ on it.
maureen #12 Yes, Tian loves to play with Mei and she’s tolerant to a point, but will put him in his place when she’s had enough.
They are a delight to watch, and I am now planning visits to the other zoos!
September 20th, 2007 at 12:44 pm
Hi Suzanne, I have a question for you. Since Mei Sheng is going to China next month, will he be housed inside from the cold? I wondered if Pandas were like walrus’ that once they were removed (or born) in a warmer climate that they couldn’t go back to the cold and I expect that where he is going gets very cold in the winter. Do they have like a panda apartment building for all their residents there?
Sorry for all the questions but we pandaholics are like sponges – give us a bit of information and we want more and more and more.
Thank.
September 20th, 2007 at 2:07 pm
I had a chance to see the lower teeth of one of the NZP ” adults” up close this afternoon on panda cam. They are are awesome, big and sturdy. They are perfectly flat across the middle with an incisor at both ends, presumably to hold the bamboo for stripping, etc. I could only see the front teeth which I presume are used mostly for stripping and eating shoots. I think they would use molars in the back to break off the thicker stalks and for chewing. I have seen models of their jaw/teeth before, but not in real life. They are incredible.
No wonder no one wants to get too close to adult pandas, like the drunk guy in China did last year and got bitten! However, seeing such powerful teeth also inspires awe at the tender use of them to gently pick up newborn cubs, and to carry them around until they are able to walk on their own. The same teeth that chew tough thick bamboo stalks also cut the umbilical cord at birth, and carefully cradle the cub in its initial contact with its dam outside the womb. Such dicotomies in nature are truely remarkable.
September 20th, 2007 at 2:12 pm
New pictures of the cub are posted. It says her eyes are beginning to open. She sure is a beautiful baby panda! Bai and Gao sure make some pretty babies. Thank you SDZ for the new pics and the continuous updates on ” our” baby girl!
September 20th, 2007 at 2:32 pm
I love the photos from today’s exam, especially the standing one, and the closeup of her face to show her eyes starting to open. She is one beautiful girl (like a cloud). She is incredibly cooperative and quiet for ” enduring” such poking, proding, and measuring. Human hands can’t be as safe and secure feeling to her as Bai’s big warm paws must be.
She is growing nicely and will turn out to be another ” Princess” just like her two sisters. Bai produces exceptionally cute cubs.
September 20th, 2007 at 2:47 pm
OK, today’s exam picture ” doesn’t she look content” is the best, most adorable panda cubbie picture ever, ever, ever! She really does look content and smiling – nice to see her eyes are starting to open. The exam video and written account are not posted yet, but I am waiting patiently as I can!
September 20th, 2007 at 3:02 pm
Lee #19,
Our bigger concern in transporting bears back to China is actually heat. This is part of the reason Mei Sheng did not ship back earlier in the summer: to avoid traveling during hot windows. Traveling during cold temperatures are more easily withstood by the panda. When he arrives on Chinese soil, it will still be warm in those southern, low altitude areas, but as he drives up the mountain pass to Wolong the temperature will drop. With Hua Mei, she did get a bit of coddling and attention to help her with her transition (including an indoor bedroom to rest in), and we expect our boy will get the same. I am sure he will adapt quickly to the temperature difference.
September 20th, 2007 at 3:10 pm
Oh, my! The 3 latest pictures of the cubbette are SO adorable. She looks so big in the one where she’s standing and the last one where she looks likes she’s sitting up, she does looks extremely content–even smiling. It’s unbelievable how panda cubs never stop ” cute-ening.”
Thanks for all the information about what is happening around the Panda Station. Also, it has been wonderful seeing Miss ” Smarty Paws” Su Lin (thank you, Pamela G) and Mr. Sheng on the panda cam. When I watch Mei Sheng, I imagine how much everyone will miss him. But he also looks like such a grownup panda that it does seem as if he will enjoy a great new panda adventure.
September 20th, 2007 at 3:16 pm
Oh my gosh!! The new pictures of our little girl are so, so adorable – the cutest ever – especially the one where she is standing on her hind legs – with her fuzzy tummy sticking out. Thank you so much for the update – you know we all wait with baited breath every week just hoping for new photos our precious little fuzz ball. I thought it was interesting that she had a little milk mustache… good job mom!! What a treat!
September 20th, 2007 at 3:35 pm
THE CUTEST! What is that in Chinese? My fave is the one where she’s smiling and her paws are crossed, so posed, poised and ladylike. A beauty queen already, now if she could only wave.
September 20th, 2007 at 4:02 pm
… oh, she waved last week – so she’s ready. I’ll get working on her crown and sash ; )
September 20th, 2007 at 5:38 pm
Hey, panda lovers! I hope you all are elephant lovers, too! Got on the website tonite to check in on Bai and baby, and saw the headline—Umoya, African elephant mom, has given birth to a baby girl elephant at around 12:30am on September 19, 2007! That’s the fourth baby elephant born to this herd of elephants since Moose was born in 2003. There are 2 younger babies—Khosi and Punga—that were born on September 11, 2006 and March 11, 2007, respectively. Also. they are expecting a fifth baby elephant in December, 2007! So, there’s a baby boom going on at the Wild Safari Park in the elephant area!
Got on the panda page and the pandacam was not showing anything. Not seeing Bai and baby, Su Lin, Mei Sheng. Don’t know what’s up with the cam, but I hope the IT guys will be able to get it back up and running! I did see baby girl earlier today laying down on her part of the hay sound asleep. Man, is she growing! The cam people did a great job getting a great closeup of her!
Well, gonna go and watch my favorite program—Survivor’s back!!! Will check back in later to see if the pandacam is back up.
Chari Mercier
St. Pete, FL
September 20th, 2007 at 6:51 pm
Amazing how baby pandas look like the weigh so much more – lotsa fluff. She’s a doll, and I can’t wait to see what name is picked.
For those asking about Mei’s trip back to China: Please google for ” chinese zoos” and make your own judgment as to the treatment giant pandas receive in their native land.
I think that from an educational standpoint, it’s very important that we understand the conditions of the zoos the pandas born on U.S. will live in when they return to China. From what I have read (and I understand that it’s the Internet, and may not be true) it’s not even remotely like the San Diego Zoo.
As I am stating this information in a professional manner, I would appreciate the moderators not censoring my comments. I believe this thread is supposed to be educational in purpose, and unless we are all just supposed to say ” oh! how cute and fluffy!” it stands to reason that we can learn how the current state of events came about, and certainly what we can do to change the plight of the panda for the better.
Paula　
September 20th, 2007 at 10:21 pm
10:15 Pacific time: The girls look soooooooooo happy and peaceful sprawled out asleepin. God I love this site. After a 14+ hour day at work, it soothes my soul to watch Bai Yun & the bebeh
September 21st, 2007 at 2:28 am
In regard to Paula #30- In regard to the Chinese zoos- Yes, the conditions don’t appear to be equal to the zoos here in the U.S. I hate to think we send these babies back to conditions they aren’t used to. Conditions appear to be very sparse and bland. I hope they have the same dedication of the staff as we have here. We can only pray. I just hope Mei Sheng will be accepted by the other pandas when he arrives. I would hate to have a gentle creature harmed. I never got a response when I raised this question previously. I guess the deal is any panda born here has to be returned to China. Oh well. I will enjoy them and pray for their safety when they are carted back to China. As for the fluff- when does the contest begin regarding the farmalization of ” Bright Stars’” name? Jane
Moderator’s note: The Giant Panda Team is discussing how the cub will be named. Please ” bear” with us and we will provide the details as soon as we finalize them.
September 21st, 2007 at 6:23 am
Paula #30,
Mei Sheng is not going to a Chinese zoo. Try googling ” Wolong breeding center” and see how incredible some of their exhibit spaces are. They have enclosed hectares of natural habitat to create large enclosures full of huge trees and vegetation that each house a small number of young bears. These large pens are really wonderful, and the tree-climbing Mei Sheng will have the opportunity to scale trees higher than anything he has had here in San Diego.
September 21st, 2007 at 6:57 am
Thanks again Suzanne for another very informative update including the one about Mei and his travel back to China. I just wanted to drop a note that the AZ gave very high comments about all the work that the SDZ has done in studies of the panda research on their update about Mei Lan, they noted the research that has been done about scent marking. Kuddos to the researchers at SDZ and thanks for all the work done because of you and the work you have done other panda cubs are able to survive and be taken care of thanks again for all your hard work and I am sure sleepless nights.
September 21st, 2007 at 7:03 am
Paula, #30, I agree that the Chinese ” zoos” are not the euphoric conditions of the SDZ. However, Wolong has a mission to preserve and protect the Giant Panda from extinction. Therefore they receive significant funds from the Chinese government for this purpose. I have read many articles about the expansion and modifications/upgrades they are doing for housing and caring for giant pandas. It stands to reason that if they want to continue to ” lease” pandas to US and other worldwide zoological institutions for research and conservation, they will have to ” clean up their facilities” or the money they are receiving will dry up. If the pandas from the US are not treated well, Americans are well known for expressing their displeasure in meaningful ways. Hua Mei has been treated well, especially while she was adjusting to her new environment. Both she and Mei Sheng are very valuable pandas to the Chinese and therefore are more likely to receive great care and attention to promote their health and additions to the breeding program. From what I have seen, the ” housing” may be more spartan, but the pandas seem to have more interaction with their keepers. To be able to reach into an enclosure and remove newborn cubs requires trust between panda dam and keeper. They do this on a regular basis, so they must be doing something to build that trust.
September 21st, 2007 at 7:09 am
Paula #30, you make an excellent point. I also have asked questions regarding the care and handling of exchange pandas in Wolong. I know that diplomacy and tact must prevail when speaking of any contractual agreements regarding panda-sharing and breeding, but I also have questions regarding the nature of things once our babies have arrived in China. Surely we can receive a bit of ” delicately-put” information regarding our ” delicately-put” questions?
September 21st, 2007 at 7:27 am
#30 – Paula, I am in complete agreement with you, and I also know what you know to be true. It is very difficult to not ” blab everything you know.” Our cultures are so different and being critical may not be the best answer to changing anything for the better. I am hoping, however, that with the increased tourism and the upcoming Olympics, there will be changes. We love our pandas so much and want the very best for them. I’m sure they do too. Now, about that beautiful baby!! I cannot believe how she is growing as I have been away from the puter for several days. As always, thanks to the great staff for all their hard work.
September 21st, 2007 at 7:59 am
The video of the latest exam really shows how much our little chubmuffin has grown. It almost sounds as if she does a little bit of ” singing” toward the end of the exam. And make sure you watch her being carried out of the exam room back to the den – chubmuffin waves good-bye!
September 21st, 2007 at 9:18 am
There are seven great close-ups of our Sweetie taken during her Thursday exam on 9/20 on NBC San Diego. Scroll down to ” Celebrity Spotlight” and click on ” Pudgy Baby Panda Peeks At Camera” .
These pictures are availabe now. They may disappear when the web page is updated. Good Luck and Enjoy. In one photo she has one eye partially open – so so adorable.
Rose
September 21st, 2007 at 9:29 am
I couldn’t believe my eyes when I saw our little girl today. I have been out of touch for over a week and boy has she grown.I am so glad that I have been able to watch the latest check-up and read all of my fellow bloggers info about what has been going on. I have seen some great photos of Wolong and there holding cells and grounds, but It’s not exactly SDZ, but It could be worse. I intend to keep in touch with a contact that I made when I inquired about our beloved Shi Shi. I am hoping to get updates and mabe a photo or two of Mei Sheng after he arrives in China. Magaret I can always count on you for your great insight and knowledge, Thank you and thanks for all the great shots of our little Bright Star
September 21st, 2007 at 10:04 am
Suzanne, thanks for the update about the new large enclosures that are being built at Wolong. Hopefully it will set skeptics minds more at ease. I recall reading that they were building them out in/to the ” forest” so they could include more natural vegetation. Your description of the taller trees sounds like Mei Sheng will have a ” built-in playground” since he loves climbing way up high in trees.
You also mentioned that the enclosures house several young bears. That answers another question many of us have been asking. At what age do they separate the bears that have grown up there as part of their ” kindergarten?” Presumably it would be somewhere around the time that they become sexually mature. If I recall correctly, I think I read that males mature at around age 6. If so, is Mei Sheng likely to have some companions (M/F) for at least the 1st year he is there? Have any cubs born outside China also gone to China to live, or are Hua Mei and Mei Sheng the first two cubs to go? If so, I am certain they are still working to carefully integrate them with the cubs that ” grew up” there. They don’t want the risk of any aggression or harm to their prize breeding bears either.
September 21st, 2007 at 10:15 am
Robin #34,
I am glad you noticed the sharing of information between institutions. We firmly believe that this is of great benefit to the species, and do collaborate with other US zoos when possible. No one institution has the facility or resources necessary to attack all of the science singlehandedly, but through collaboration and information sharing we are better able to develop an undersatnding of panda biology and conservation options.
September 21st, 2007 at 10:35 am
Suzanne, I read an article ” Gene Bank to Help Giant Pandas Carry on Ancestral Line” about a gene bank the Chinese are building which will include sperm, ova, tissue, DNA, etc. This will allow them to breed pandas even after they are deceased to preserve their gene pools.
In 2007, Gao Gao’s semen was collected at his annual physical and used to artificially inseminate Mei Xiang at NZP. Unfortunately a pregnancy did not result from this procedure. Will you be collecting semen from Gao Gao again at his next physical? If so, will you store it at SDZ for your potential future use, or will it be sent to Chinese Gene Bank or possibly to NZP to try again.
Would the Chinese ever attempt to breed Hua Mei with Gao Gao either in ” person” once he returns to China, or using his semen? That could potentially combine his ” wild” genes with those of Shi Shi in one genetic line of progeny. Since Hua Mei is not related to Gao Gao there should not be any genetic cross-overs.
Once the Gene Bank becomes a reality, is there a potential to start mixing the blood lines from Wolong and Chengdu Research centers since both are participating in the program?
For anyone who wants to know more about the scientific advances in breeding going on in China, Google ” Gene Bank to Help Giant Pandas Carry on Ancestral Line .”
September 21st, 2007 at 10:58 am
To those of you discussing Chinese zoos and the Pandas: From what I have researched and read and seen, Wolong and Chengdu are two of the best places for a captive Panda to live in China. The facilities are constantly being upgraded and expanded because of the captive breeding program, the staff have increased contact with personnel from American zoos so they can exchange information concerning nutrition, training, veterinary care, and new technology, and the two breeding centers are constantly under foreign scrutiny due to the many visitors they have. Some of the money paid to the Chinese to lease the Pandas goes to these breeding centers. Young Pandas, and Pandas of breeding age, are very well cared for there.
However – and it is a big however – once the captive Pandas are too old to have or sire cubs, many of them are moved to Chinese zoos. And some of those zoos are not capable of providing the wonderful habitats that we see here in the US, or in Spain or in Hong Kong. Some of those zoos are small and poor. Most of them try hard to provide the best care they can for their Pandas, but their best is a far cry from the air-conditioned comfort, enrichment, and superior nutrition that we see in the top zoos. I am far more concerned about the return of Bai Yun and Gao Gao to China than I am about the return of Mei Sheng, Su Lin, or Tai Shan. Our beautiful Madame Bai will be joining the geriatric set soon. What will happen to her? Will she end up in a third-rate zoo somewhere deep in China, eating and sleeping in a concrete habitat with no grass under her feet and no trees? That thought haunts me, and there is nothing our zoos can do about it.
I know that China ” owns” the Pandas and, in accordance with all of the complex international agreements between governments, zoos, and environmental/wildlife groups, has the final say in the disposition of almost all of the captive Pandas, but I do so wish that governments, scientists, and zoos could negotiate new agreements that might, for much smaller fees, allow foreign zoos to adopt these wonderful geriatric bears that have contributed so much to the breeding programs. Twenty old Pandas in twenty American zoos at $5,000 per bear per year is $100,000 more a year for China’s Panda program.
I realize that the problem of the older bears is much more complex than can be discussed here, but it just seems to me that Bai Yun, Gao Gao, and all of the older bears deserve better than to disappear into third-rate Chinese zoos, their contributions to the survival of their species forgotten.
September 21st, 2007 at 12:07 pm
Know some of you may be worried about what you read but I really really suggest you go onto the Wolong and Chendu web sites were these bears come from. Also I know alot of you go on NZ cam look at the pictures that they have posted from their curator who went to Wolong and also on Discovery Chanel or Animal Planet they had special about Wolong and the pandas coming here to the NZ. Their is also a group called Pandas International who support the work done at Wolong and do really nice fund raisers. We have to remeber that the United States has diffrent priorties and the zoos all do fundraisers to be able to afford some of the equipment they have. But from what I have seen Wolong is more like a big open nature center and the people their honor the pandas and I believe love them a great deal.
September 21st, 2007 at 1:09 pm
I just read that there have been 13 cubs born in Wolong as of Sept 14, 2007. So we know that there are at least 16 born worldwide, 1 in SD, and 2 in Vienna (one of which died)
September 21st, 2007 at 1:29 pm
Suzanne, you looked as cute as a panda cub in the recent video! Next big ” visible” change would definitely the little girl’s eyes fully opening and hearing improving. And that’s when the super cuteness explodes! It’s amazing to know how small Mei Sheng once was, and this little one is going to be that big some day.
Inspired by Margaret’s #43 post – How about a story about the Frozen Zoo? I’ve seen the facility during the Taste of CRES tour and it’s just amazing. ” Little Gao Gao’s in there…lots of him…”
September 21st, 2007 at 1:36 pm
Pamela G, #44, you bring up great points about geriatric pandas and where can they go when they are past reproductive stage of life.
However, we must remember that Bai Yun and Gao Gao were both Chinese celebrities before they came to the US, and they will be when they return. Shi Shi is one of the oldest living pandas, and although he may live in what we might consider ” spartan” conditions, he receives excellent care and lots of human attention in his old age. Basi is also a geriatric bear and she is receiving great care and attention.
As pandas age, their need for moving around probably diminishes in captivity, since their food is readily available and they don’t need to forage. However, even in spartan zoo environments, attempts are made to provide them with enrichment via toys etc. They still get human attention and contact, so they are not left totally alone to fend for themselves ” out on the streets.”
As international scrutiny is applied to the burgeoning panda cub population, and China’s official policy of not ” renting” pandas out for political reasons but only for research purposes, this situation will continue to develop. As Pamela G suggests, it would be ” nice” for pandas, the burgeoning cub population, and we humans who enjoy them, if they could move to international zoos who have the financial means to provide them with more ” cushy” homes. As the current breeding population ages, there will be new opportunities for ” research” into geriatric nutrition, exercise needs, etc., and these could conceivably be met by foreign research institutions such as SDZ, NZP, etc. There are many world-class zoological research institutions who can, and I suspect will, help when the Chinese government makes that option available.
Until then, lets enjoy the 5 wonderful pandas in our midst at SDZ. There is enough time in the future to look at the scenario that ” could” develop.
September 21st, 2007 at 2:00 pm
The cub has grown so much in the 14 days since the September 6th exam, shown in the picture on the panda cam home page. The pictures are incredible. Wish they were a little larger, but appreciate their being posted so quickly.
September 21st, 2007 at 3:00 pm
Ohhhh….ohhhh I’ve been away so I didn’t get to see my baby panda. I peaked in and I was looking at mom…so loving with her little cublette sitting in her paws…like a big girl.sooooooooooooooooo cute.
You know how this cub is quiet… and she’ going to be named if I counted correctly on Nov. 11, 2007 (veterans day)… something translated in Chinese using ” peaceful†feels right to me or ” tranquil†just my input…I’ll love her no matter what….my ” peaceful princessâ€
September 21st, 2007 at 3:00 pm
I just rewatched the video of the latest exam, and noticed that our cubbette sounds like a Chinese opera singer. We keep calling her a star – maybe she’ll be an opera star.
I had the privilege to visit the Chengdu center 6 years ago and, while I can’t comment on quality of care versus what happens here, I did find it to be very interesting and the people I met were very knowledgeable about their charges. They also have a large population of red pandas which are fascinating to watch.
September 21st, 2007 at 6:24 pm
I would like to thank those who have commented on my concern related to treatment of animals at Chinese zoos. Honestly, a part of me wishes I had never googled for ” China zoos” and that I was still blissfully unaware of the inhumane treatment of pandas and other animals. In fact, I routinely donate and respond to WWF and other universal humane groups, so I can’t believe this came as such a shock to me. I am very happy to hear from Robin, Margaret and Suzanne and their assurances that Mei will be well cared for in her native land. However, Pamela, Jane and Barb bring up points that disturb me greatly as to a) the secrecy and ” ownership” involved in the breeding program; b) where old pandas live out their final days; c) overall conditions in Chinese zoos.
Margaret, you commented (parphrasing) that pandas going back from the U.S. are already celebrities in China, so they will receive good treatment back on their native soil. How heartbreaking is it that a panda must be born here and be a ” celebrity” to receive humane treatment in China? Support of the San Diego Zoo is obviously a great 1st step to ensuring the best possible life for these gorgeous bears, and I think looking ahead to a goal of keeping the pandas in the U.S. is paramount. I simply can’t think of another non-native endangered animal bred in capitivity in the U.S. that has to be returned to it’s land of origin.
Candy, sounds as if you’re in China – thanks so much for your comments…I won’t ask you to elaborate. I would also like the thank the moderators for allowing me to comment on this subject.
_________________________________________________________________________
OK, back to cuteness! I have seen so many webcam shots of the little one by herself today – looks as if Mom is feeling confident about leaving her baby alone.
TAMI: ” peaceful princess” …I love that!! I suggested ” He Ping” for ” peace” but now that it’s a SHE we’ll need something that sounds more feminine!
Thanks all,
Paula
Paula
September 21st, 2007 at 6:55 pm
Regarding the Chinese & the pandas – while I have not been lucky enough to visit China I do know that the panda is considered their national treasure & while their zoos may not seem to be up our standards am sure that China will do everything possible to make the lives of older pandas comfortable. I just read an article the other day stating that China (after 1300 years) will no longer make an ” outright gift” of pandas to a country. Their thinking is if a zoo has to pay ” $million a year rental” they will do everything in their power to breed & take the best care of this wonderful rare animal. China now decides which nation they want favors from when they offer ” panda rentals” . Our only hope for our own US pandas died when Ling Ling & Hsing Hsing were unable to produce a live cub. So now we get to watch our beloved pandas on panda cams & cry when they have to return to China.
September 21st, 2007 at 7:46 pm
An interesting book…. ‘The Lady and The Panda’ tells the story of the woman who first brought a panda
to the U.S. and helped these beautiful bears in their fight for survival.
Thanks to the SDZ for allowing us to see and learn so much about the pandas!
September 21st, 2007 at 9:03 pm
Hello everyone,
I just wanted to say, I watching the news tonight on a local Quebec TV station at 11PM ET, and just as the news bulletin ended, I was VERY happily surprised to see our little Cubbette appear. She looked absolutely adorable!!! I guess you can expect a few more panda fans from Quebec to appear on the site thanks to that, LOL!!!
One thing though, the reporter mentionned something about her ears being open. However, I do not seem to have seen that information anywhere on the site, so I was wondering, do they something you haven’t told us, or did they just get the info about the eyes wrong and mistook it for the ears? (The thing is that in french, eyes is ” yeux” and ears is ” oreilles” . Just by the spelling, I guess you can understand that they sound pretty different orally, and I’m wondering how they could have got these two words confused…) Waiting for your answer on that!!!
And in the meantime, I’m off to go watch some more PandaCam. Can’t wait to see the little butterball starting to crawl and walk around all over the place
Clara
September 21st, 2007 at 11:18 pm
” 2days Small Group Giant Panda Tour to Wolong Reserve With Panda in Lap for Picture
And you can ask our experienced guide to arrange for you to take picture photo with pandas (hold panda baby for photo in your lap) in cub panda house, of course taking picture photo with baby panda cost you extra. Some time not available for photo with panda and play with panda.”
Thanks for the Wolong information, Suzanne. I found the above quote from their website… I always wanted to play with a baby panda bear, but in the back of my mind I felt it wasn’t the right thing to do. Especially if it ” cost me extra.”
Paula
September 21st, 2007 at 11:57 pm
I have looked at the Wolong research centre and they have great facilities for the panda babies,just look at the climbing apparatus they have and they do have a lot more area to run about in.The adult pandas also have vast area’s to move around in,the birthing areas may not look so plush but what would they get in the wild,not 5 star hotels I am sure! I think we tend to think of these bears as humans rather than wild animals and we put our thoughts and feelings into place ,I think we must remember that when the bears return to China they are cared for by people who really love and dedicate their time to these beautiful creatures,the wages are bad but at least they are getting the right people to do the caring.
September 22nd, 2007 at 4:56 am
Pamela G #44, I deeply share your concern about the return of the US pandas to China. The environment of many Chinese zoos are not satisfactory and sometimes, undesirable. Although Wolong and Chengdu are two of the best places for captive pandas to live, I was upset when I saw Hua Mei’s den for giving birth of her cubs. Given said that, I would like to salute to the Chinese giant panda experts for their great effort, sweat and tears over the past decades in saving this precious animal and attempts to release them to the wild.
As you many know, Hong Kong is a densely populated city. Notwithstanding the habitats for the 4 giant pandas in Hong Kong are relatively small, they are air-conditioned and well maintained and the giant pandas are receiving world-class expert care and enrichment. There are plans for expansion and preparation for the 2 cubs Le Le and Ying Ying, both age of 2, reach their reproductive stage. I am delighted that Hong Kong, being the Special Administrative Region, is having the privilege that the 2 mature pandas Jia Jia and An An, ages of 21 and 29 respectively, will stay in Hong Kong for good and need not to return to China.
Many thanks for the SDZ experts for the great care to Bai Yun, Gao Gao, Mei Sheng, Su Lin and the super cute baby girl. May I also send my love to sweet Mei Sheng, I will miss him much!
September 22nd, 2007 at 8:04 am
Conversation with Bai Yun #6
Tourist: Hello, Madame Bai Yun.
Bai Yun: Hello, Mr. Tourist.
T: Now I see you’re having some nice treats here…
B: Yes, it’s my morning break.
T: And I hear your little Bright Star is growing fast.
B: Uh huh.
T: And she’s really exercising those limbs of hers.
B: Yup.
T: And her left eye is opening up…
B: Oh, I’m not surprised.
T: Huh?
B: Yeah, her left eye is opening before her right eye.
T: And you knew that would happen?
B: Not really. Just that I was not surprised.
T: Why do you say that?
B: Well, didn’t you notice she waves with her left paw when she’s before the camera?
T: Hmmm. Come to think of it, you’re right. Oh, uh, I mean, correct.
(at the examination table)
Vet 1: (whisper)
Vet 2: (whisper)
Bright Star: Squeak (Yikes! Can you folks dim the lights, please?)
V1: (whisper)
B: [Oh, it's Eau de Dr. Meg again. Ah, what a wonderful massage! Let's do more.]
V2: (whisper)
B: Squawk! (Constraint by Project Tape Measure? I protest.)
V1: (whisper)
V2: (whisper)
B: [Whew! It's time to go now?]
Keeper: (whisper)
B: [A-HA! I surmise Project Immobilization Right Paw again! I guess it's training to salute with my left! Right-O!]
September 22nd, 2007 at 9:29 am
Seeing everyone call the cub Bright Star reminds me of the late Hsing Hsing from the NZP. I think that’s what his name roughly translated to. It’s great to see the panda population starting to bounce back. We should always recognise the great efforts by Dr. George Schallart, and Professor Pan Wenshi. They’re commitment to the survival of the Giant Panda was all inspiring. Panda conservation has come a long ways since the 1980s when not much was know about the animal and one of the first research stations had a vet who specialised in poultry to study and care for the pandas (The famous ” Chicken Doctor” ) as described in Dr. Schallart’s book ” The Last Panda” . This book I believe is a must read for all panda lovers but be warned; it’s not for the faint of heart. But the trials, successes, and heartbreaks bring meaning to the spirit of ” So that others may live” .
September 22nd, 2007 at 10:24 am
Paula – No, I’m not in China. However, I have developed a friendship with a few people in China – two of them with connections to the zoos there. I do believe that changes for the better are coming.
Our zoos are an excellent example for demonstrating best practices for the care of animals in captivity. They seem to be so open to sharing their research and learning from others. This is imperative in a time when global warming, loss of habitat, and wars raging in countries where so many species of endangered animals are trapped, that zoos may seem to be their only future. On a lighter note, the pandaholics in this blog community give me so much hope for change because of the diversity of ways we are spreading the word. Over the years in this blog, I have read of teachers who have the cams available in their classrooms, parents and grandparents involving their children and grandchildren, poets, children, intellectuals, bloggers from other countries, people sharing with their co-workers and friends, and just plain animal lovers like me. Thanks to all San Diego Zoo staff for bringing us the cams and the opportunity to learn from you and each other.
September 22nd, 2007 at 12:05 pm
Hi! Got on SDZ panda site and pandacam to check in on Bai and baby girl. I did see the baby all by herself by the den door resting very nicely while momma Bai was out eating and resting. One of these days, she’s gonna figure out those legs and feet and then look out, she’ll be off and walking out of that den! I did see the vet update about her the other day. I’m glad that her eyes are finally starting to open up! Milestone No. 4 (?) being accomplished as we speak! Now that she’s getting those little peepers opened up, she’s going to start really focusing in and seeing this huge new world of hers. That’s when she’ll get started trying to use those legs of hers to start moving around so that she can see alot more than what’s inside that den! More fun to come, pandalovers!!
Been reading a lot of these comments today. Some were funny and cute, some were on the serious side, especially about the zoos in China. I do agree with a few of you that talked about Wolong and Chengdu Research Centers for pandas. They are really the ones that are working very hard to get the info they need to understand these pandas, their funny actions, their crazy attitudes, their different behaviors, what they like and dislike, and other things. The one attempt to release a male panda earlier in the year by Wolong was a good achievement even tho it didn’t last very long. I know that they will continue to work on this to find out which panda will be better suited for release into the wild. That’s a work in process in itself! All 4 US zoos have ties to Wolong and Chengdu, and the collaboration between the US zoos and these panda centers have been very good from the info I’ve been reading about over the last couple of years. More work will need to be done to really try to understand these precious animals, and I hope that China will do a lot more work in saving a lot more of the habitat for these pandas to live in.
Well, gonna go and watch some football and the pandas!
Luv yas to Bai and baby girl,
Chari Mercier
St. Pete, FL
September 22nd, 2007 at 1:45 pm
Like many people I have been viewing the PandaCam since it commenced and recall the excitement when Bai Yun gave birth to Hua Mei, and the very happy time she spent at SDZ.
Hua Mei was the wonderful panda with a ’smiling face’ who enjoyed gazing at the sky to view ‘birds’ or ‘aircraft’ that entered her air space.
It was heartbreaking when Hua Mei eventually had to leave for China, there were many tears shed on that occasion.
Prior to Hua Mei leaving for China, SDZ had a lovely picture of her on the site saying ‘Goodbye’ in many languages, other people may recall this feature.
I am therefore wondering if this has been considered as a ‘farewell’ for Mei Sheng…. it would be a nice gesture for our special boy who we will all miss immensely.
September 22nd, 2007 at 4:19 pm
One more comment about China & their pandas – if you listen to the izoofari chat with panda keeper, Kathy, who spent 3 months at the Woolong research center, it sounds like the pandas there have much more room to roam than our zoos here. As far as keeping older pandas here in the US I understand that it costs each zoo hundreds of thousands of dollars a year for bamboo, upkeep, staff & other maintainence – zoos are questioning the cost of keeping a panda, especially an older panda who requires more care. While zoo attendance surges with a cub it still is very costly.
As far as the comment about the birth of a cub in a small den, pandas in the wild use hollowed out tree trunks as dens – in the wild there are no 5 star hotels (SDZ, NZ or ZA) with vets, keepers & volunteers ready to step in. Mommy has to leave her newborn for hours to forage for bamboo – a very tough life.
But on a brighter note, listen to the latest izoofarichat with keeper, Kathy, who provides a ton of info about the personalities of each panda & how they start interaction with a newborn at an early age.
And then, if you love all animals listen to the chat about the latest baby elephant born 9/20 – that was fascinating also.
Now to our fat cub (as keeper, Kathy called her), loved the pictures of her latest exam – she sure does a fat belly-wonder if fat belly will hinder her trying to get on the go??
Moderator’s note: iZoofari Chats can be found at http://www.sandiegozoo.org/wordpress2/category/izoofari-chats/
September 22nd, 2007 at 5:46 pm
If pandas born in the U.S. must go from the San Diego Zoo (Hilton hotel) to a Chinese preserve (Best Western motel) I can certainly live with that…but my original post spoke more to the pandas (and other animals) that aren’t born here and live in Chinese zoos. I certainly hope conditions and relations improve on that front, because I was really heartbroken at the images I saw and the words I read.
I have a question – my husband’s uncle lives in San Diego and visited the zoo last week – he said the caretakers showed the baby cub to onlookers. Is that correct? My family is visiting Thanksgiving week — around 105 days, so the little girl will have a name – will she be out and about? In looking at the other cubs, it seems they weren’t in the public spotlight until around 5 months. I gather this is a decision made after determining the personality of the cub and mom?
Paula
Moderator’s note: No, the cub is not receiving any visitors yet.
September 22nd, 2007 at 7:09 pm
WOW! What an excellent video, iZoofari Chat and list of blogs, since the last exam! I’m so glad to be able to put a face on the voice, Suzanne! I’ve loved all the info you have given us along with your ichats. The ichat from Kathy about the differences in the cubs was priceless!
The nature of some of the writings this time have crossed my mind, too. It’s natural for animal lovers to HUMANIZE or beloved creatures. We can not help it. I know that the Chinese consider pandas a national treasure and I’ve seen lots of pictures from the Wolong site that are wonderful. The birthing areas do appear rather spartan BUT they very seldom EVER lose a cub and MANY of these are twins, so we have to be very confident in the great care that they receive. I really wish they would leave the cubs with their mothers longer but maybe when they get a very strong population, they will be able to do it.
September 23rd, 2007 at 1:33 am
#27 #60
desi, cute in Chinese is He Ai while Cutest is Zhui He Ai (most cute).
Tony De, I’ve been reading ” The Last Panda” with tears. I’ve read some books and articles written by Professor Pan Wenshi and Hu Jingchu, another prominent panda expert in China. I trusted what Dr. Schallart wrote in his book. I hope I can make a trip to Wolong soon and see what changes have been evolved since early 80’s then the book was written about. Though, I still have a kind of bad feeling toward Wolong.
I’ve been Chengdu Panda Reserve Center in the fall of 2002. It was just a 2 hour visit so I couldn’t comment on the quality of life of pandas there. Anyway, I found the environment and the facilities quite impressive.
Returning to our cub, she is growing fatter and cuter. Very lovely. In Hong Kong, we love to call cute and fat baby ” siu fei chu” (fatty piggy) intensively.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:45 am
I am watching Bai feeding her boisterous young lady and handling her with amazing dexterity, Bai is an excellent example of parenting.
Bai’s ‘Rising Star’ is growing so fast that I think she could now be classed as a a Cherub as she has such angelic qualities.
Regarding the cubs impending venture into the big world outside the den, Bai will be there to assist on every step of her journey, occasionally leaving her to ensure she makes her own effort to go forward.
I recall when Bai carried Mei Sheng outside with her and left him on the grass for a short while so he could become accustomed to new surroundings, I feel certain we will see this with her new cub in the foreseeable future.
I will miss seeing Mei Sheng with his gentle nature, it seems like only yesterday the heading was ‘Who is your Daddy? (Bai also had AI) – as we all had hoped it turned out to be the newly arrived – Gao Gao.
The wonderful relaxed Gao Gao has continued to chew on his bamboo and make his contributions to new cubs at SDZ. – we are most fortunate to be able to view such magical moments.
Thank you to everyone at SDZ who makes this possible……
September 23rd, 2007 at 8:52 am
P. Wong, you are sooo talented , I am still catching up on everything after being laid up for a week, just when I needed a laugh there you were Thanks. I was able to watch ouir little girl this morning, haveing breakfast and later all curled up. at one time all I could see was a big white ball of fur, you guessed it, it was all bottom. she is getting so big.
September 23rd, 2007 at 9:09 am
#27 #67 sorry for a mistake has made. The Chinese translation of ” cute” should be ” ke ai” while ” cutest” is ” zui ke ai” .
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:34 pm
#67
Y.H.Ng
I hope to make it to China someday perhaps after retirement. I have such great respect for Professor Wenshi. He championed conservation of Pandas and other species even during the Cultural Revolution when animals weren’t high on the government’s priority list. Professor Wenshi was even jailed for a time but he persisted. Today China has a pretty good conservation program. From what I’ve seen and read of Wolong and Chengdu, the facilities there look pretty impressive. The Chinese people have always been a people one with nature. We use to celebrate when Wolong produced five surviving cubs as a crowning achievement. Now cub births from 12 to 20 are almost common. Again due to the great scientific achievements and cooperation of scientist, educators, and the peoples of all great nations who are dedicated to the preservation of this remarkable animal. I think you’ll find your trip to Wolong most enjoyable and it may diminish whatever uneasy reaction you might feel about the facility.
Tony De
Clearwater FL
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:21 pm
I am so amused to see Bai using the cubmuffin as a pillow these days, exactly the way Mei Xiang did with Tai Shan when he was about this size. I imagine the dams do it so they will be awakened/alerted if the cub makes a wrong move while mommy is sleeping. It will be interesting to see how long our little girl puts up with it. Tai wasn’t very happy about it, as I remember, and attempted to wriggle away whenever he could.
Also, the iZoofari chat was amazing, thank you so much for these wonderful materials. You’re all terrific and I don’t think I am alone in my admiration and gratitude! We are so lucky to have the quantity and quality of information you provide.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:17 pm
#66 — You’re certainly right about the wonderful care the panda cubs receive in their homeland. Hua Mei, the first panda cub born at SDZ has already had more babies than her MOM has. If memory serves me correctly she has had three sets of twins.
We must remember that the Chinese are doing everything they can to preserve the pandas and their amazing success with keeping both twins alive in twin-births is astounding. I think we should give them the benefit of the doubt. After all, many of our own zoos here don’t have the best of conditions for some species. A zoo in Wisconsin that I know of had to end both their elephant and rhino exhibits because the quarters were too cramped and didn’t allow for sufficient ” roaming” room.
The Chinese are not going to risk one of their most treasured and precious assets.
The new little one is just TOO adorable and I’m proud to have seen every one of the four most recent cubs grow and develop. It’s always such a treat and wonderful opportunity. I can’t help but smile whenever I look at either still or moving images of pandas.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:42 pm
Aprox. 8:40 pm Central time…Bai Yun and cub are just outside the den door playing!!
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:48 pm
Wow, what a thrill just now (9:45 EDT), Bai had the cubbette out of the den & I was able to get a wonderful glimpse of our Bright Star for several minutes before Bai moved her back into the den. I think we’ll see more of this behaviour as Bai gets more comfortable with the cub out of the den.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:54 pm
Great scenes of Bai and baby between 5 and 7 pm, Sunday. Love to have been able to take some pictures. Bai took the cub out of the nest twice, and after the second time you switched the cam to Su Lin so we could not see what happened after the second outing. At one point it looked like Bai was trying to play with the cub, but she may have just been cleaning it.
September 24th, 2007 at 4:22 am
Wonder if our cub had her 1st camp out? I do not see her in the den this morning and I read that Bai had her out a couple times last night. Another milestone – moving out into a bigger world!
September 24th, 2007 at 7:39 am
Just a quick note to clear up what I had said earlier…it is not the research centers that I’m referring to, it is the zoos in China.
September 26th, 2007 at 7:58 pm
Carolyn Says:
September 23rd, 2007 at 9:43 pm
No Matter how hard I try and understand I will never understand why man still finds ways to interfear with Mother Nature and the Panda’s should remain in there family circle to begin with at the San Diego Zoo and China should keep only ones that they have raised. Why do they always have to separate family?
We dont like it when we are separted so I think the whole thing is crazy and I fill very sorry for all the adjustments the animals have to make because man cant figure it out!
September 26th, 2007 at 9:35 pm
Tonight I noticed the cub has not been in the den for over 1hr. now. Is Bai Yun taking her out for longer
periods now while she eats ?